Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Flareon350

Utility Pack - Discussion

Recommended Posts

This is the official discussion thread for CCLP4 voting's Utility Pack. Feel free to share your thoughts, opinions, and comments on the levels here!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Utillity Pack has just been updated. A Counting Puzzle (#11) was unsolvable and has now been made solvable.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

#2 (Association for Cryptology Masters): I was legitimately confused when I first solved this level: the title, hint, and general layout (as well as its placement in the set it originally came from) suggested that this was supposed to be a monster challenge to crack, and then it turned out to be hilariously simple to solve, which turned out to be completely intentional. I enjoy this type of level for a CCLP when done well, if only to serve as a fun diversion for later in the set when a certain level of expectations has been built up.

 

#5 (Outwit): We've seen teeth melee levels and teeth manipulation levels, but never an effective marriage between the two. This level accomplishes that in a way that I can't honestly say any other official levels have done so far. The entire thing feels so tight yet open-ended enough that you can escape out of tricky spots in ways that perhaps you didn't originally envision. I also appreciate the division of the level into quadrants, as well as the teleports available between rooms. Overall, I'm really hoping this makes the cut.

 

#9 (Daydreamer's Maze): I love this idea but didn't feel like the scaling of the "checkerboard" worked well. There are mazes that get you lost, and this certainly accomplishes that well, but it does so in a way that I found frustrating: by making each square big enough that you can't really see over to the next unless you brute-force each possibility, sometimes on repeat visits. Also, was the space-filling path to the exit necessary?

 

#11 (A Counting Level): I was the one who discovered this was unsolvable (and even after four people voted on it at that!). Interesting idea, but once you figure out the gimmick at the beginning, the rest becomes a generic itemswapper that doesn't bring anything particularly different to the table.

 

#20 (Alcknalkcxa): This feels like a spiritual successor to Bummbua Banubauabgv from CCLP1. As such, it managed to subvert my expectations: I thought there was going to be a bunch of fancy block setup to get the water spaces next to the exit filled, but it was deceptively simple. I still like its predecessor much more, but this was fairly decent.

 

#26 (Oasis): There are some levels you play prior to voting but take some time to grow on you. This is one of the ones that just improves with each subsequent play. I love the aesthetic: everything feels ripe for exploration, and each room just oozes theme. I especially like how you find the giant spring of water in the exit area! I wouldn't mind seeing this as an introductory CCLP4 level at all. It's head and shoulders above the similarly themed level from CC2.

 

#30 (Frozen Waffle): Pretty much everything I said about the previous level applies here too. I feel like there's a tendency to use either a DOUBLEMAZE-esque layout or a set of curved, criss-crossing paths to make an ice level more complicated, but this one totally eschews both and opts for an evolving simple set of squares that holds the player's attention throughout.

 

#35 (Colour Control): Speaking of eschewing popular design tropes, this level! It's only 12 by 10, and usually, the first thing that comes to mind whenever I think of tiny levels is a stuffed room filled with a bunch of seemingly random elements that have to be navigated in order to win. This level thankfully does not run with the rest of the tiny level pack in this regard but instead has a theme, a clearly laid out puzzle, and a devilishly tricky solution to deduce. It actually took me quite some time to crack this one, but it was very satisfying. Highly recommended.

 

#38 (Lara's Hedge Maze): Sorry - not particularly a fan of levels that require this level of precision.

 

#40 (Life, the Universe, and Everything): I love how this level and The Answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything got randomly selected to be in the same pack. This one is by far the one I prefer between the two.

 

#50 (Exercising Bug): An interesting concept, but it's one of those levels that ventured a bit too far into lateral thinking territory for my tastes. It eventually got to the point where I just started building bridges and didn't realize how impractical my setups were until late into my attempts, which was frustrating even the actual solution's length.

 

Favorite level: Oasis

Least favorite level: Colour Rush

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

#9 (Daydreamer's Maze): I love this idea but didn't feel like the scaling of the "checkerboard" worked well. There are mazes that get you lost, and this certainly accomplishes that well, but it does so in a way that I found frustrating: by making each square big enough that you can't really see over to the next unless you brute-force each possibility, sometimes on repeat visits. Also, was the space-filling path to the exit necessary?

 

You might not be able to see the paths across the ice sections but at least none of it leads to death, which I think is more frustrating than just being lost. I think mazes that get you lost to that degree make for great levels. And no, the path to the exit wasn't necessary :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I'm way too slow with these packs. Anyway...

 

1: Most boring and inaccurate level title in a long time. However, it is a nice concept.

 

2: I know I've said negative things about this level in the past. In the end, it's not that bad, it's just ordinary.

 

3: Surprisingly fun.

 

4: Great nightmare level.

 

5: It's really not that good, I think.

 

6: This was in Po100T and was one of the worst levels of the set.

 

7: I already played this in JoshL6 and JCCLP2, and it's fun.

 

8: Overly long.

 

9: This is a good maze, but I've seen better ones, and the time limit is too strict.

 

10: One of the better Jeffrey levels.

 

11: This is an interesting concept, but putting the pink ball room so late in the level is really stupid.

 

12: A good dodging level that does not waste any space.

 

13: I think this was in NeverStopGaming. While that set's name is really nasty, this is a fun level.

 

14: There is no challenge in this.

 

15: I know this is a rush level, but the time limit is short even for a rush level.

 

16: The title and hint made me realize how pointless everything is. That's the best part of the level.

 

17: The whole blue key thing is not required, is this a bust or intentional?

 

18: I made this one. I'm surprised to see it made it into voting, considering how short it is, but all right...

 

19: This is a really weird level. Pushing blocks is not even required, except at the start!

 

20: This is a Rock level, I think, and I find it to be a boring puzzle.

 

21: Interesting concept, although it gets repetitive.

 

22: At least there are patterns and it's not total guesswork.

 

23: But THIS one is total guesswork.

 

24: Most accurate level title so far.

 

25: UNEQUAL: The blob and green key room. Either way, it's absolutely ordinary.

 

26: Short but fun.

 

27: That's a really nasty level, for reasons already described in my latest JCCLP2 review.

 

28: Creative shape.

 

29: I've seen MUCH better blue wall mazes than this.

 

30: It's a good level.

 

31: Interesting concept, but slightly frustrating.

 

32: The starting slide is really nasty. The maze feels pointless.

 

33: Amazing concept. Much better than I expected at first.

 

34: I really like this level.

 

35: random 8 busted this. Also this is just terrible.

 

36: It has some interesting concepts, but it failed to make a strong impression on me.

 

37: Reasonable race level.

 

38: An unusual type of strict time level, but it works very well.

 

39: Another level where the player must not only dodge monsters but avoid buttons. What a pain.

 

40: This is the second level with this theme in this voting pack, and the other one is better. Either way, I find it ordinary.

 

41: Ordinary.

 

42: The first room is good. The rest...not so much.

 

43: The title has nothing to do with the level, but it is still fun.

 

44: I played this in JCCLP, I think, and I find it ordinary.

 

45: This is much easier than expected.

 

46: Interesting concept.

 

47: Annoying maze.

 

48: That's a really silly puzzle.

 

49: I found this much easier than it is probably supposed to be.

 

50: I think this was made for a Create Competition, and I understand why it did so poorly.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

13: I think this was in NeverStopGaming. While that set's name is really nasty, this is a fun level.

 

What the heck is wrong with NeverStopGaming as a level set title? :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

9: This is a good maze, but I've seen better ones, and the time limit is too strict.

 

25: UNEQUAL: The blob and green key room. Either way, it's absolutely ordinary.

 

27: That's a really nasty level, for reasons already described in my latest JCCLP2 review.

 

29: I've seen MUCH better blue wall mazes than this.

 

35: random 8 busted this. Also this is just terrible.

 

9: You say that about a lot of mazes, chipster :P curious to know what actually is a better maze to you.

 

25: That's not unequal at all. The blob isn't that hard to avoid in MS. :) and I really don't see what's ordinary about it.

 

27: The dodging in this level is near the start and isn't that hard to start with. You can easily memorize the monster cycles. As for the key room, that part of the level is pretty trivial as well.

 

29: Again, you said the same thing with Blue Tooth from an earlier pack :P also curious to know what is a "better" blue wall maze to you.

 

35: How is this terrible exactly?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What the heck is wrong with NeverStopGaming as a level set title? :P

I just don't agree with it.  It might be a good idea to stop gaming at some point to focus on more fulfilling and positive life accomplishments.

 

9: You say that about a lot of mazes, chipster :P curious to know what actually is a better maze to you.

25: That's not unequal at all. The blob isn't that hard to avoid in MS. :) and I really don't see what's ordinary about it.

27: The dodging in this level is near the start and isn't that hard to start with. You can easily memorize the monster cycles. As for the key room, that part of the level is pretty trivial as well.

29: Again, you said the same thing with Blue Tooth from an earlier pack :P also curious to know what is a "better" blue wall maze to you.

35: How is this terrible exactly?

 

This is what I prefer in blue wall mazes:

*Mostly blue walls, but hidden walls and invisible walls can also be all right.

*No teleports, toggle walls or other such complexities.

*Decent time limit.

*If other tiles are to be included, such as ice or force floors, there should be a pattern.

 

25: Yeah, the blob is really not that much of a problem. And I have played better levels in JCCLP2.

 

27: Perhaps the dodging is all right, but it took me many attempts to finally get all the keys (and I had to use the editor).

 

35: Extremely precise timing is required; in Lynx, a delay of even a single tick can kill Chip.  Or am I doing things wrong?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

27: Perhaps the dodging is all right, but it took me many attempts to finally get all the keys (and I had to use the editor).

 

That room isn't rigid and a hint states there's nothing under any blocks unless you push them yourself :P so I have to say that's an unfair use of an editor in my opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

35: Extremely precise timing is required; in Lynx, a delay of even a single tick can kill Chip.  Or am I doing things wrong?

 

 

Here's my solution, no ultra precise timing required :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

35: Extremely precise timing is required; in Lynx, a delay of even a single tick can kill Chip.  Or am I doing things wrong?

You're probably doing it wrong. The only things that require timing are the tank and maybe tank button presses.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Here's my solution, no ultra precise timing required :P

Maybe it doesn't need to be THAT precise.  But still, I'm not very good at levels that require (not so) precise timing.

 

You're probably doing it wrong. The only things that require timing are the tank and maybe tank button presses.

...which amounts to pretty much the entire level.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe it doesn't need to be THAT precise.  But still, I'm not very good at levels that require (not so) precise timing.

So your shortcoming makes the level bad?

 

...which amounts to pretty much the entire level.

I don't know. Personally, i found the pink ball/block/lock mechanism and the amount of thought it requires to be more significant than the tank.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So your shortcoming makes the level bad?

Perhaps "terrible" isn't the best choice of adjective, but fact remains that my poor dodging skills prevent me from finding the level fun.

 

I don't know. Personally, i found the pink ball/block/lock mechanism and the amount of thought it requires to be more significant than the tank.

 

There is a difference between puzzle difficulty and action difficulty. While figuring out the puzzle may be a challenge, executing the solution still consists mainly of tank dodging.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a difference between puzzle difficulty and action difficulty. While figuring out the puzzle may be a challenge, executing the solution still consists mainly of tank dodging.

You said the tank dodging is "pretty much the entire level." I'm saying the level is more than its action difficulty.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You said the tank dodging is "pretty much the entire level." I'm saying the level is more than its action difficulty.

I agree that there is more than action difficulty to the level.  What I meant was that executing the solution was pretty much only dodging the tank.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

More feedback!

 

5. Nether Fortress

 

This was one of my favorite levels in the set it comes from and replaying it definitely brought back some good memories. The overall design and aesthetic is very nice and enjoyable to look at and the level itself didn't get boring. My only nitpick with this is the block pushing near the bottom was kind of tedious but I know that could be have been a lot longer and I appreciate the designer didn't abuse that. Otherwise, a fun level to play!

 

10. Wall Jumping Up Waterfalls

 

Loved the concept, loved the design, loved the title. But it wasn't as fun to play as I had hoped it would be. The starting room especially, I wish that was at the end of the level instead of at the start because I did not enjoy having to redo that segment every time I messed up elsewhere, it just made it less fun.

 

12. Aggressive Colony

 

Now this is a great melee level - one of my favorite ones actually! And I don't even like melee levels to start with! Not only was it contained (which I really, really appreciate!) but I enjoyed playing it a lot. Never got frustrated with dumb deaths and that is always a good thing. CCLP4 is gonna need a couple dodging themed levels and I really hope this will be one of them.

 

15. Colour Rush

 

Least favorite level: Colour Rush

 

Ouch. I honestly don't see why this is with J.B. because I certainly think there's much worse levels in this pack. But opinions are opinions, and my opinion is that I liked this level, though the time limit is a bit too strict. There's a level similar to this seen in the Souvenir Pack that I strongly prefer over this but regardless, this was a pretty good time crunch challenge. :)

 

23. No Return Level

 

Your first word in your title summarizes my thoughts on this one. Why this made it in voting is beyond me. Yeah that's harsh but levels that intentionally require guessing and nothing more? Come on, let's move on from that please.

 

29. Air Shaft

 

Okay so I can't always avoid talking about my own levels and as much as I don't like doing that, I want to with this one. This is one of my favorite blue wall maze levels, if not my absolute favorite. Not just because I designed it but because the lost factor remains throughout the playing experience, which was my main goal. If CCLP4 is going to continue the trend with the decade messages, this would be a perfect fit for the Level 61 slot.

 

36. Forsythia

 

My favorite level from probably my favorite designer (Y)  Do I need to say more? This version of the level still has 4 chips counted for so I guess I'll say that. But seriously, this was just so much fun to play and the recessed wall/fire boot section was very well done. I will be very disappointed if this doesn't make it in the final set.

 

37. Shemozzle

 

My favorite level from another one of my favorite designers (Y) Also my favorite time crunch level ever, this never got boring to play and the design/theme/concept of this level is amazing. Another level I really hope gets into the set.

 

44. Fiery Fogstorm

 

Again being one of my levels, I can't avoid talking about this one either. I was a little surprised (not disappointed) this didn't make it in CCLP1 and honestly I think this level has a better chance for this set instead of CCLP1. Most of the reason why I think this is due to the force floor precision timing in the lower right, which is probably the reason why it didn't do well in CCLP1 voting. But for a set like CCLP4, a little bit of precise timing that doesn't really punish you wouldn't be so bad. However, all that aside I do still think this level is fun to play and is a good example of how to use invisible walls in a good, non-annoying way which was my overall goal.

 

Favorite level: Forsythia (36) / Shemozzle (37)

Least favorite level: Brute Force (4)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Brute Force (#4): That blocksliding section was painful, which is a shame because without needing to manage the tanks there this could actually be a fun level. I especially liked the key room- very clever tank usage!

Wall Jumping Up Waterfalls (#10): I like the concept I used here- hadn't seen similar "fill the central force floor slide" levels at the time I designed it...certain parts of the implementation, on the other hand, I don't like. I shouldn't have started the level off with a lengthy sokoban, or included two potential collision herding puzzles afterwards. Honestly I feel like if the puzzles were in reverse order it'd be stronger, but as it is it's still a good level: but can definitely see the complaints here as I have them too.

Endless (#16): For a primarily row-based aesthetic, this actually looks pretty nice! The puzzles involved aren't too difficult on thinking them through, but they're complicated enough that you really can't just blitz through. I don't think the method I used for the northeast fireball/recessed wall section was the intended one: I had several stray fireballs, extra recessed walls and I believe an extra block. Still, fun puzzle!

Xehanosia (#19): This is one of the best open collection levels I've ever played.

No Return Level (#23): Why? I thought we were past "lol guess right or restart" levels? There's really no redeeming qualities to this one- closest comparisons are Cellblocked and Pentagram. Cellblocked has a structure to it that makes it clear where you can and can't go, and Pentagram has a pattern that removes the guesswork once discovered.

The Answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything (#28): Cardinal sin of level design: unclear trap connections. It's not terribly interesting, and the red key seems to cook the level if obtained when it looks like you're supposed to have to set up a partial post later. Teleport shenanigans + traps + no real options + blind timing = not a level I enjoyed.

Shemozzle (#37): That's a rush level. I like those quite a bit actually, especially in the 'variety' category like this one. Time limit is a little lower than I'd have set it- I finished with 21 seconds left after a little bit of practice. The fireball room in particular I'm not really a fan of, but that's a minor nitpick on an otherwise exceptional level.

Life, the Universe, and Everything (#40): Very enjoyable and relaxed variety level. No really connecting theme, nothing tedious or all that difficult, either. Just a collection of fun sections composed very well- there's open-ended options!

Push (#42): Very strong first room, very strong yellow lock room...unfortunately, the level suffers from rigidness and repeating known (or even trivial, such as the second room) sections over while trying to figure out the core puzzle. Still a strong candidate, just not as strong due to the room ordering.

Exercising Bug (#50): There are levels that work well as puzzles. There are levels that work well as levels. There are puzzles that work well as levels. This is a puzzle that's no fun to play, as attempts take upwards of 3 minutes just to see if you hit on the right idea. I love the concept here, but hate the execution: on a smaller scale this would be fantastic.

 

Favorite level: Green of Tourmaline (#25)

Least favorite: No Return Level (#23)

Non-obvious least favorite: Exercising Bug (#50)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now this is more like it!  Plenty of strong candidates all over this pack.

 

Some favorites:

 

#5 Nether Fortress:  The aesthetic of the bombs everywhere and the gravel in the starting area is just fantastic.  It's cool that you have to blow some of them up to get into various rooms, but it's pretty easy to tell which ones need to go.  A level full of manageable puzzles that unravels itself as you go.  Being able to have free reign to blow up a bunch of the bombs in the south due to the cloner was also cool.  One minor point of confusion was the room with the fireball cloner, as I didn't quite grasp what was causing the continuous cloning until after a couple tries.  Once I did, it became a frantic and exciting dodging challenge in an otherwise fairly calm level.

 

#18 Magic Block:  The solution to this level is not hard or involved.  In fact, there's not much freedom or decision-making at all.  But hot diggity dog, is it creative!  It felt like a real magic show, as the illusion was flawless.  The designer knew exactly what the room would look like after each step in order to replicate its appearance in the next.

 

#35 Colour Control:  Let's just say this manages to pack an impressively devious puzzle into a small space.  Quite a few factors have to be accounted for with the limited resources you have.  It does require precise timing, but it's short enough for that be nothing more than a very small annoyance.

 

#36 Forsythia:  What can I say?  The level has some creative puzzles that mesh together really well.  The fire boot/recessed wall contraption is something that I've never seen anywhere else, and the Monster Sorter section is a different take on something that I've only rarely seen.  The way the blocks are re-used later in the level after you solve the initial sokoban is just a beautiful design choice.

 

#39 Toggletank Factory:  Hectic!  That's how it appears at first glance, and then you realize how well everything is set up for you to avoid causing disruptions to the monster cycles.  It takes a bit of foresight--recognizing that you shouldn't venture into the southeast before you pick up a blue key, and that you shouldn't let the horizontal pink balls into the path of the vertical one that bounces from (26, 9) to (26, 15), but these were easy enough to spot that I don't consider them unfair.  It's still a pretty tense level with lots of dodging, but in my opinion it's fun to discover and solve each new challenge in it.

 

Honorable mentions:

A couple of blue wall mazes.  I actually prefer #9 Dayrdreamer's Maze over #29 Air Shaft.  Both were easy to get lost in, but Air Shaft consisted mainly of a tree of twisty-but-ultimately-linear paths where your only challenge is making sure you remember to push on every wall, whereas Daydreamer's Maze had loops and, in my opinion, a more logical structure, making it a more likable experience to solve.  I finished Daydreamer's Maze with only 84 seconds on the clock (which is pretty close to my initial solve time of Mazed In) so I agree with Chipster that its time limit could be bumped up a bit.

 

Others I liked included Pongo, Alcnalkcxa, Frozen Waffle and The Crusher.  Also, One Tank's Adventure is in my top 3 of my own levels that I really want to see in CCLP4, just because I'm not sure I've seen a level that focuses so strongly on the concept of escorting a single tank.  I wouldn't mind seeing Brutal make it in as well, as I think it's a tough but fair level that's decently fun to play...but I can see how the beginning ball challenge might turn a few people off.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×