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No Mouth discussion

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I opened this thread to give you the opportunity to tell your opinion about my first level set.

Criticism wanted!

EDIT: Updated! Download if you wanna play "Dotted holes" (13), "Fuse" (17) and "Eating mushrooms" (18)


Edited by Bouncycles
Set updated
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I played through most of these levels and took a look at the tougher ones in an editor. I'm no expert designer myself, but I can tell you what kind of things came to mind when I was playing your levels. Here are some first impressions :)

Short tutorial (the first one). I liked this. A fine start to the set.

Two Gliders. And then we get to some complexities. The puzzle is nice, though the red key red herring is not something that really enhances it. I don't know what the trapped Glider is for. I wouldn't mind seeing more levels like this.

Getting outside. This was a bit too complicated for me, particularly as a third level. I like trying a set blind, and the first few levels are the ones I focus on the most. They give me an impression of what to expect from the rest of the set. If you're making stuff like this that take me a long time to solve, I rather jump ahead and pick the best ones to use my time on.

18 buttons. I really enjoyed this concept. I even tried making a level myself that would borrow it, but just throwing together rooms didn't end up too great. Your level doesn't make things too difficult, and I feel there is potential here. The hint says you don't like this level, but I think it could be improved greatly by just changing the ending mechanism. Why do you require the player to go through the traps twice? To make sure the Gliders really are already in a loop? Still, there are better ways to do this. The first thing that comes to my mind, is having a corridor of bombs, Chip goes through a pop-up, presses a tank button, tanks move onto traps, and as the traps open, they destroy the bombs. This way Chip is not trapped in the traps himself, and it's enough to trigger the buttons once at any point instead of exactly when Chip is in the corresponding trap. (And if you want to require pressing the traps twice, you can make two waves of tanks.) Hopefully that makes sense, and maybe instead of fixing this level I'd like to see a sequel that refines the concept.

Suspicious looking level. Not much to say about this one. It's an item swapper that you have to think about. The buttons aren't situated in a way that makes it easy to deduce what each one does. I like hiding the hint, but still all walls as blue is a bit bland.

Water all around. Ice Cavern. Skipped these one, sorry. I do wonder about how you are capitalizing your level names. And while on that topic, some of the level names are not memorable, so maybe spend a little more time on those when you make a level you like. There's a whole page for this on the wiki, or you can ask on Discord for inspiration.

Monster exchange. I liked this puzzle. (It's the only one I remember seeing a preview of on Discord, plus a section of Dottet holes). If only the game allowed for more trap connections, this would be a cool concept to use in a longer level, with small puzzles building to a larger one. As it is, this could work well as one section of a larger level, though having it as it's own level is fine too.

Dungeon. I skipped this one. When there's a lot going on on the map, it's just easier for me to move on and see if I like other levels more.

An unpleasant journey. A fine dodging level. Not too easy, but also not too long. Doesn't work in Lynx due to the blue key (and the buried tile you added), but you could swap colors around and get it working, though then you should also rework the trap area too. (It works fine with just one Fireball, and in Lynx the other one escapes so another fix for that could be to change the surrounding dirt so it ends up elsewhere than it does now.)

Chaotic session. This looks like one of those levels that I wouldn't like, but as I played it I found it clever though a little too tricky. I would have liked it more if it had been half as short, as once I figured out one side of the level and then attacked the other one and died, I pretty much had forgotten how the first side worked.

Down the slopes. Some interesting stuff here. I was a bit disappointed with the final trap/cook when I got stuck at (31,15). WHY? There was no fun in that. But I did enjoy the puzzle.

Dottet holes. This looks really clever and it is. But there are so many sections that all require such precision. Why not split these all up into smaller levels? What's wrong with small clever levels? I didn't work through all of this yet.

Short tutorial. I like sequels to levels, but at least give them a new name. This was too complicated for me to play without a map, so I went on to the next one. 

Machine out of control. I really liked this one. This is a sort of slow dodging chaos that I haven't really seen. The structure was good too, allowing me to pick which way I went, and having two sections. This built up excitement to reach the second section well, and having more could have been too much.

Vacation on blue island. Didn't get to this one yet.

Fuse. I looked at this in the editor for 15 minutes and didn't get far along. It's really complicated and looks like everything needs to be done very precisely. The concept looks cool though. I'm just confused on how to do everything I need to do, and where exactly I needed to go. When are blocks used on traps and when are they for bombs and when are they used for deflecting Fireballs? Not sure if this needs any fixing or anything, just telling you the things that were enough to throw me off.

Eating Mushrooms. The time limit was pretty strict. If you really want someone to solve the puzzle on their first attempt, don't add so much stuff that does nothing. But it looks good, so I would rather see a higher time limit.

So far I have enjoyed the levels. Many of them were pretty difficult and had a lot going on. I will gladly play a difficult level, but if you can tone down some of the visual complexity, that would be welcome. Don't always use all the tiles. Use a bit more space in your rooms. Get to the meat of the puzzle. While you had some cool ideas and clever little rooms, your best levels were the ones where the objective was clear because then those ideas were on display more. I will gladly play more of those. Thanks for sharing!


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Thank you for your comment. Feels good to know that someone took a good luck at my first and in many ways improvable set. I updated it and here is a short list of what I changed (and what I did not) regarding your comment:

-Getting outside: Well, because this is a beta I didn't mind about level order. That's why this level is number 3. Besides improving some small things (and adding two new levels) I also changed level order in the update (I hope that won't make things too complicated)

-18 buttons: yep, you are right. I didn't know how to do the end and the level isn't the best. Thanks for your improvement ideas. I didn't change the level in the update, but I'm not sure if I'll reuse this concept in another level.

Water all around: Renamed it into "If you had those blue boots". I know this is a difficult level, but that's exactly the sort of level I like, so I'll keep it like this.

Ice cavern: Renamed it into "Icy lake crossing". It shouldnt be that difficult as its divided into smaller puzzles.

An unpleasant journey: Sorry, forgot to fix this. I'll look on that on a later update.

-Down the slopes: Removed final trap. Nothing more to say about it.

-Dotted holes: What's wrong with smaller clever levels? Nothing really, but I'm more into lengthier puzzle level. I know, this is controversial and I get your point but I don't think I'll change this. I know the second section is difficult, but when I put it into one small level, I've got the feeling it's incomplete.

-Short toturial : This is intendet to be the last and most challenging level of my set. Renamed it to "shrot toturail" to make the difference larger.

Fuse: it's possible. Maybe it helps you when I say that the fireballs are freed in the order they are on the fuse.

-Eating mushrooms: I don't quite get it why someone should complete it on their first try. It's intended to be a small challenge. Anyways, I added 5 seconds. ;)

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